Windows don’t stop it. Thin walls don’t stop it. Not even earplugs stop it. For hours, the bass from the Baltic Room would thump thump thump and there’s nothing Joe can do about it.
“Nobody in this whole process is aware what 65 decibels of sub bass sounds like in their home,” said Joe, who has requested his identity be kept anonymous in order to avoid the ire of club goers. The 65 decibels he refers to is the new amplified sound limit set by the Seattle Nightlife Initiative, which announced a series of rule changes Thursday.
“The new rule is the product of extensive community input and consultation with nightlife businesses,” according to the press release announcing the new policy. “It includes incentives for businesses to mitigate noise complaints before facing fines and enforcement action. McGinn will conduct an annual review going forward, to ensure that rules are fairly enforced.”
In fact, early in the process the Nightlife Initiative was considering a limit of 80 decibels, said McGinn spokesperson Aaron Pickus in an email. “It was originally set at 80 db, but after hearing from community groups and working with nightlife businesses we settled on 65 db.” As we reported Thursday, another Nightlife Initiative change will allow drivers on Capitol Hill to prepay for the first two hours of parking in the morning, giving them more time to safely retrieve their vehicles.
Before setting a limit, the ordinance was fuzzy, mandating that amplified noise was not to be “plainly audible to a person of normal hearing.” The fuzziness of this rule was ripe for misunderstandings, as was demonstrated in an email from Decibel’s Sean Horton to the Stranger’s Line Out blog after he said SPD threatened to shut them down for being too loud at the Baltic Room:
…we were clearly under the 90dB noise ordinance limit (readings came in at an average of 75dB through out the night, while standing directly out front of The Baltic Room at 1207 Pine St). We monitored the volume all night and I can say for certain that had the police been monitoring the volume with their own dB meter, they would have come to the same conclusion. If we’re under the limit, how are we breaking any law and how can we be threatened with a shut down/incarceration if there’s no police evidence that we were over the limit?
Seattle Police have been mediating the dispute between Joe and the Baltic Room, and club operators are working on adjusting their sound system in order not to affect surrounding residences.
“SPD is doing an amazing job being a great mediator in trying to figure out a solution for everyone,” said Jason Brotman, co-owner of the Baltic Room. The club has been upgrading their sound system gradually over time, and there were a couple nights where the music was too loud, he said.
Joe said the sound levels have been better since the SPD intervention.
“I have heard something, but it hasn’t been enough to bother me,” he said. Brotman said he is appreciative of Joe’s efforts.
“He’s a neighbor helping us figure out how to make it best for all of our neighbors,” said Brotman.
Now that the Nightlife Initiative has set the limit at 65 db(C), the question remains: Is that still too loud?
“65 decibels in a residence thumping for three hours a night is absolutely unacceptable,” said Joe. Others would likely disagree. But now, at least, there’s a number to talk about. If you can hear over the thump thump thump, that is.
Problem fixed!
If you don’t like street/nightlife noise don’t live in a night life/commercially zoned part of town…it’s that simple.
No one forced “Joe” to live in this neighborhood…ZERO empathy for his plight. It’s not like The Baltic Room relocated to a strictly residential area..it was there YEARS before “Joe” moved in.
I do understand why Joe objects to the noise. I don’t understand why Joe doesn’t just move out of an area occupied and zoned for night life and allow someone who enjoys that kind of atmosphere move in.
Problem solved, Joe!
Is the limit supposed to be in effect all the time? Or only after 11 or 12 or something like that? Because if that’s the case, they need to do something like take ‘zones’ into account; if you move into a neighborhood w/ a bunch of clubs, deal. If a new nightclub opens in a space that was previously a retail shop or something, then they’re the ones who need to deal w/ their established neighbors. But seriously, if this is in effect all the time, can I call the cops on jackasses with leafblowers?
How long has Joe lived there? Clearly you must know?
If you don’t want to hear noise, move to the burbs or Queen Anne. Don’t move to possibly the loudest block in the city. Jesus.
Looking at the actual Nightlife Initiative, it looks like the dBC limit was 80 (now 65) INSIDE the receiving residence with doors and windows closed. Correct me if I’m wrong here.
If this is the case this seems more sane to me. When I first saw the 65 dB limit I was shocked because most clubs would get shut down if you stood out in front of them with a meter, 65 dB is basically the loudness of a normal conversation.
Regarding “Joe”, I have to say considering that there appears to be no actual residences within 100 feet of the Baltic Room, I find it somewhat hard to have sympathy, especially since I-5 is right next to such buildings as El Capitan, where surely the noise from the freeway approaches 60 dB.
Furthermore, that area of the hill is one of the more urban and busy parts of the neighborhood. Trying to be a squeaky wheel and get businesses shut down because they boom the bass a few hours a night is lame. I find it sad that some people live in the city and yet expect absolute silence from their neighbors. Go to Manhattan and see how you do there, trust me it is noise central. If “Joe” actually lives in one the older buildings I’m thinking of, why not get double-paned windows and improve your sound-proofing? I have been in El Capitan (for example) and the sound proofing is very very poor.
Agreed. Joe doesn’t even really have to leave the hill if he wants. There are plenty of “residentially” side streets full of housing around here. If the bottom of your building is commercial, then you should expect noise, crowds, and all that jazz.
This is a great example of how Seattle is willing to stop something very popular over one crazy person complaining. Get with it Seattle. There is a noise ordinance. The Baltic Room either violates it or not. If they do, they should be given the chance to come into compliance. If they don’t, someone should fine Joe for taking up Police time. The dude is obviously obsessed with sound and other people. It’s a sign of mental instability. And Seattle needs to stop letting these mentally unstable people make city policy.
I would agree with the “move” suggestion but for one thing—who was there first? I live next to the Redwood on Howell. When I bought my condo, the bar was a laundry! The noise Is so bad in the summer when doors and windows are open that the apartment building directly across has problems keeping the apartments rented. The apartment has been there for decades. The condos are owner occupied. To whom would you suggest we sell to? There aren’t that many deaf people.
No, the problem is zoning. Businesses that generate excessive night noise do not need to be in residential neighborhoods.
I must admit, I’m a little puzzled as to why all of the commenters seem to think that high noise levels are the price that must be paid to live in the city. High noise levels lead to physiological damage, and we should no more argue that “people should just move” than we should argue that “people should just move” to get away from industrial dumping. Manhattan is the place where there are limits on the noise levels of air conditioners and the European Union is putting in place noise maps and noise controls in much more cosmopolitan cities than poor Seattle.
If we all live in a densely populated area (and we all should), then we should do what we can to make it a livable area and that means living harmoniously.
Not only could he move to other parts of the Hill that are zoned more to his liking, he could move TWO BLOCKS SOUTH and be somewhere that’s not next to a club. I, for one, like loud clubs, but also wouldn’t want to live above or next to one. Luckily for me, I thought of that when renting my current apartment and didn’t make it a problem for all the customers who go there willingly, even after knowing the noise level, and the business that serves them.
That’s a ridiculous comparison – can you really compare industrial dumping with being in a loud club? Forget “in a loud club” and replace it with being “outside of a loud club.” In the first instance, industrial dumping would leave a person with potentially carcinogenic exposure just for breathing the air. You’d have to some exposure to loud music for a long period of time up close to have any actual physiological damage, and it’s unlikely any neighbor or passerby would ever experience anything but mild annoyance at the noise coming from Baltic Room.
Obviously most of you have never lived close to a nightclub. I understand what Joe’s talking about.
You know, I looked at an apartment above a popular bar in Fremont. It was a funky, quirky apartment and could have really fallen in love with the place. But then I thought about the noise that would bleed from the bar and I thought to myself, “You know, I don’t think I could live like that.” So I passed on renting the apartment.
Don’t you think that if I had considered all of that data and then rented the apartment and then complained to the city about the noise that would make me kind of an asshole?
Freeway noise is indeed distracting, but it’s a somewhat constant noise level. In time it becomes “white noise” and most people who live by the freeway don’t really notice it that much. The ever-changing “bump-bump-bump” of the base, however, is something that you never get used to. Actually if you could hear the full music, it might not be so distracting. But the constant base will drive you crazy.
you forgot…the baltic room is an industrial dump!
Everyone has the right to reasonable peace and quiet in their own home. This is the only way a city can function.
The argument that the bar was there first really doesn’t hold up under any sort of scrutiny: My understanding is that “Joe” had no problems with the Baltic Room until they “upgraded” their sound system. So that means that Joe was there before the sound system and therefore it’s the Baltic Room which needs to accommodate Joe. In fact, the space which the Baltic Room now occupies has only been a bar since the mid ’90’s—it started out as Kid Mohair—and, for the first few years of its existence, the Baltic Room was sort of a hip “piano bar”. People making this bar was here first sort of argument usually wind up stating that any commercial space which could possibly become a noisy bar has the right to do so. By this argument, no one who wants a reasonable amount of quiet—say, anyone who works during the day or who has children—could live anywhere near any commercial space. This would leave most of the central city to…who?
Hard as it is to believe to some, bars such as the Baltic Room appeal to a minority of adults. Most of our
adult lives are spent on the other side of 35, and this sort of nightlife is only one relatively small part of city life. Can one seriously argue that a noisy bar has the right to turn its immediate neighborhood into a residential dead zone? This is a perversion of any sort of urbanity.
And to those of you who fancy yourselves to be such savvy urbanites: New York City’s noise ordinance places a limit of 52 decibels from any stationary source—which would include music from clubs—
measured three feet inside an open window of any residence. A 65 decibel limit inside a closed window
is absurd.
Well said!
Thanks for this viewpoint. I think it is shared by many who don’t spend a lot of time commenting online. Excessive noise is absolutely a health issue – both physical and mental. Exposing other people to your noise seems to me to be comparable to exposing them to your cigarette smoke, and densely-populated, civilized areas need to find a way to balance the needs of those who want lots of noise with those who don’t. And this doesn’t mean all those who don’t want excessive noise have to live in Sammammish.
Seriously, does anyone know if this rule would apply to people leaf blowing for hours and hours just to get up a few leaves that could be raked up much more quickly? These machines are especially intolerable in the summer when many of us choose or are forced by heat and lack of air conditioning to keep our windows open. And they’re worse than club speakers in that they also generate noxious fumes.
I’m going to go out on a limb here and say “money.” I don’t know what planet you live on, but where I come from it costs money to move. If these shitclowns at the Buttlick Room are violating the noise ordinance, it’s them who should move.
Dude, not cool. Like, the Baltic is a totally jammin’ place, and like, I don’t even know this Joe guy. I don’t know what all this law and ordinance stuff is, but, like, I like the Baltic better, man, and since I don’t hear it at my place I totally think this Joe guy is, like, totally bogus.
Don’t be a bummer, dude.
What a sad joke all you urban hipster morons are.
It’s too bad there is a whole generation brought up on earbuds and ecstasy, a generation who can’t hear a damn thing below 120dB, a generation who can’t enjoy music without being doped out of their minds on artificial euphoria.
Now, you’re also proving to be cyber-bullies.
If you told me to my face to move for complaining about noise from a club two blocks away, I would totally kick your ass.
When I moved into Cap Hill 8 years ago, I was specifically looking for an upbeat, dense, vibrant neighborhood. I was perfectly aware that there were loud & quiet spots all over the Hill. I am not independently wealthy so I was definitely restricted in terms of choices, but I managed to find a great place NEAR my fav clubs, but far enough away that I didn’t have to live with it if I didn’t want to. Recently, I moved again, and you know what? I found ANOTHER apartment that fit this criteria. In fact, there’s apartments ALL OVER THE HILL that fit this criteria. Who knew? o yeah, the people who actually pay attention to where they are moving to.
But this Joe situation is a symptom of a bigger problem, that of the extreme passive/aggressive nature of Seattle, and society’s attitude as a whole that everyone else is responsible for making us happy & comfortable.
Hey Joe: move, get some ear plugs, or shut up. The majority of us (and I’m 37, BTW) like our noisy crazy hood, that’s why we’re here. Why are you here?
like, lol … i mean srsly . , ., lol
“…society’s attitude as a whole that everyone else is responsible for making us happy & comfortable.” For expecting reasonable peace and quiet in our own homes? Really? You sound like a demented Ayn Rand.
You say that you love “our crazy noisy hood” but even you don’t want to live close enough to be affected by bar noise. Now tell me: How would you feel if the laundromat across the street turned into a loud thumping club?
According to the article you have chosen to keep your identity anonymous. I can respect that. But, there is no real difference between your anonymous complaining and our anonymous posting.
You are much too fragile.
Clubbedtodeaf, or Joe, or whatever your real name is (You make decibel reader apps for iPhones right?), your threats of physical violence in a forum are actuall illegal, the moderator of the site should remove them and ban you. But they also show your mentality and that of the people like you who obsessively complain about life in the city. You’re a crazy little bully who has a hard time engaging in dialogue but instead threatens to fight people at a coffee shop (high school anyone?) or even worse, call the police on a small business instead of just talking with them directly. You are the type of person that makes living in a city suck
First of all, if you read the report, Joe is not trying to “shut down” the Baltic Room. He is trying to reach a compromise, and even the business owner says he appreciates Joe’s efforts.
Secondly, your suggestion for Joe to sound-proof his apartment is not realistic. Obviously, the apartment owner would have to do this, and for all the units, not just Joe’s. Do you have any idea how much it costs to replace windows for an entire building?…answer: many thousands of dollars.
420Dude: Great satire!
And this begs the question of what will happen with the condos that will be right above CC’s. I’ve noticed on redfin a few condos in that building for sale, and they seem like good deals. My guess is the noise issue.
I guess for anybody considering a move in a densely populated neighborhood, visit the building on a weekend night to get a feel for the dynamics of the building. I think a coffee house below your bedroom window would be just as bad on a sunny weekend morning with your bedroom window open if you worked swingshift.
And what of the commenter who bought a condo above a laundromat that became a nightclub? They had one of those quiet, yet urban, environments. That was changed by a change in tenancy. I don’t know the solution for this issue.
Hey Whoknew,
First complaints were all direct: Two in-person visits to tell them the thumping was rattling my windows two blocks away (the on-site manager’s response at that time was that they were exempt from noise restrictions …). Following those complaints, there were a number of e-mails, also involving someone in the Mayor’s nightlife office. Only after weeks of no resolution did I (as is specifically prescribed by the noise ordinance) begin calling police.
Before every call to police, I made absolutely sure that the noise was in fact coming from The Baltic Room. This meant getting dressed, walking the two whole blocks to The Baltic Room, measuring the sound, measuring it again halfway between my place and the club, and again outside my place. I did not, especially, want to blame The Baltic Room if the noise was actually from The Chapel, or one of the other clubs closer to me. The ordinance also requires, unfortunately, that I specifically request police contact. This means waiting another period of time for officers to arrive and enter my place to observe the noise. Yes, in order for me to make a noise complaint, and for it to be effective, I need to welcome the police into my home late at night.
I had to go through all that shit because a few (not all) narcissistic DJs were disregarding the instructions of The Baltic Room management. The worst night, by the way, was always Monday.
I also mentioned in another forum that I would strongly support funding from the city to help clubs properly reinforce for containing noise. This is already being done in the form of expertise offered by the city’s nightlife office. As expensive as it is for a club to build for big sound, it is less than the cost of all the irritation and conflict.
Also, I made it clear to police, to the baltic room, and to the city, that the overall sound is not a problem. I did not want them to have to turn down the music un-necessarily. The only issue is the sub-bass, which at times was reaching my place at over 80dB, with inside levels in the low 70’s. And I am two blocks away! I live on one of those side-streets w/o clubs that you all suggest I should move to …
So, WhoKnew, you’re just a dumb thug. Well, it’s high noon …
The Editor in Chief of a thuggish nihilist tabloid rag here in Seattle expressed that it is their view that any sound at any level at any time should be legal. That same rag came into existence largely on support from big tobacco, and had a similar stance about people’s right to smoke … and people’s right to impose their second-hand smoke on others. Thumping bass is analogous to second-hand smoke. Just look at the research. It is an insidious form of pollution having ill health effects of which most are largely ignorant.
That humanity-hating rag is now primarily a whore to the club scene (as if city life revolves around 120dB dance music). That rag now advocates complete and total sonic anarchy. Their very own bloggers are virtual cyber-bullies for the cause.
The reality is, on any given night, especially on weeknights, only a very small fraction of the city’s citizens are out at clubs that produce bass loud enough to seriously disrupt their neighbors.
Unfortunately, that small fraction of the population have as their defining anthem the Beastie Boys tune “Fight for your Right To Party”. And they have on their side a rag whose lifeblood is the advertising dollars from the alcohol scene.
As switched amplifiers and neodymium drivers make absurdly powerful sound cheaper and cheaper, this problem will get worse before it gets better.
The good news is that the Mayor’s new rule is in fact not the law. Even if a club is in compliance with the Mayor’s rule, they are still in violation of other provisions and laws that apply to noise. Absent action by the city council, it is still illegal for a club to produce sound that reaches a receiving residence, with windows open, that exceeds 60dB, or, if that residence is in a purely residential area, 57dB.
the Baltic Room was testing the limits. If you heard it, be sure to complain. If you live within two blocks of Pine and Melrose, that rumble was The Baltic Room.
Here’s how to complain:
1. During the day, call the non-emergency lines for the East Precinct. There is an officer tasked to community policing issues like this.
2. At night, when it’s occurring, call 911. I know, this seems extreme, but it is the prescribed method and the 911 operators are trained to handle it. Be sure to request contact. You can ask for contact only if necessary for enforcement. Provide your location and the location of The Baltic Room (1207 Pine).
3. E-mail the nightlife office of the city of seattle.
These things should be totally banned. Not only the noise, but the fact that these kick up a cloud of all the carcinogenic particulate pollution that’s settled there. The operators of ’em for sure are gonna develop lung cancer.
Okay….Only someone who hasn’t been paying any attention to the economy for, I don’t know, the last three years would have the nerve to suggest that someone just pick up and move by selling their condo.
I don’t know if Joe owns his space or not, but other commenters on the thread do own condos that have, post-purchase, ended up being near a loud club. The point of living in a vibrant community like Capitol Hill is that we have to find a way to live together. As someone who has lived on Capitol Hill for years and who is just in the process of purchasing a condo here, I care a lot about the neighborhood and I have a stake in it. I don’t see Joe calling for the Baltic Room to close down: he’s just trying to find a way to make living in this environment workable, which is something we should all do. That means everyone has to give a bit, and it doesn’t seem unreasonable for decibel limits to be liveable.
You same people move to Seattle and complain about the rain.
Move somewhere quieter. Like pretty much ANYWHERE else in the city.
I totally understand you and the noise would probably drive me crazy too, but its not like you are being forced to live there.
Upon further review, I discovered that the decibel limit for music from bars and restaurants in NYC is 42 decibels (on the A-scale) inside a residence, not 52 as I wrote earlier. There is also a provision for dealing with bass sounds.
… so, I just made the 911 call … it’s been thumpin’ in my place for over an hour. I just measured and documented the noise, and thus have irrefutable proof that The Baltic Room is in violation of Seattle Municipal Code Ch. 25.08.
That law requires that after ten, the exterior sound must be no more than 60dB. McGinn does not have the power to arbitrarily exempt any industry from that law. I expect it to be enforced.
Shut up nerd.
Starting sometime later this week, I’m going to park outside One-Term McGinn’s home and subject him to 65dB of thumping until 2am.
Actually, it’s more like if I moved into West Seattle and the aluminum recycling factory modified its cooling process, resulting in rain downwind every night from 10pm to 2am, with that rain containing corrosive and carcinogenic waste. Yes, I would complain about that.
“If you told me to my face to move for complaining about noise from a club two blocks away, I would totally kick your ass. “
It’s johnny bridge & tunnel here to passively aggressively glare at us from across the street. You’re a low self-esteemed internet toughguy, that’s for sure.
“You say that you love “our crazy noisy hood” but even you don’t want to live close enough to be affected by bar noise. Now tell me: How would you feel if the laundromat across the street turned into a loud thumping club?”
It didn’t. This isn’t a new “problem” for the Baltic Room, it’s been in operation for a while.
“rain containing corrosive and carcinogenic waste. Yes, I would complain about that.”
So would any sane individual. Thankfully, this is not a biological hazard, and your analogy is thus very inappropriate.
Perfect analogy. Shut up Maus.
It doesnt matter how long this has been a problem. At least you agree it is a problem so it needs to be resolved. Now shut up.
The pot is calling the kettle black Maus.
Hey Maus,
Of course Nomaus is correct, but it is in fact a new problem. Joe didn’t start complaining until the Baltic Room installed a more powerful sound system.
it is legal to call 911 about noise complaints, but it is hard for me to feel that it is ethical when it’s a repeat issue. people are trying to get through on 911 to report rape, assault, medical emergencies, etc… situations where people are in danger of dying or in the process of dying. is an annoyingly noisy club more important than someone hiding in their home from a person with a gun? :/ our economy isn’t great right now and police resources are spread thin to the point where it can take a long time to get a response to a really dangerous situation. i’m an insomniac and i know what it’s like to lay awake night after night. but i don’t consider that more important than someone who is lying in a pool of their own blood and waiting on hold.
this is to joe, but it won’t let me reply directly to that…
our rain already contains carcinogenic waste from factories. :(
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Environmental_issues_in_Puget_S
In response to “who was there first, Joe or Baltic” – if Joe has been living there since before the Baltic, why has Joe not been crying for years? This seems to be a recent development, and I know Baltic has been worse in the past than it even has been recently.
This is one more thing that will contribute to the continual decline of ANY culture in Seattle. SIFF has gotten pathetic, our other theatres are in decline or closing or can’t afford to bring interesting retrospectives to town that are hitting NY/SF, local businesses are dropping like flies or getting shut down by people buying out property to build gray concrete cages for people to live in, and in this case international musicians are going to say “Seattle? Why bother, the cops interrupt concerts that the city is a sponsor of!”
I wish Joe could afford to live in one of those concrete caves that are strangling this city to death, but he’s probably as broke and at the mercy of this declining garbage as the rest of us. For whatever reason the city will jump at his command though at the expense of the rest of us. I echo the sentiment, you are getting what you signed up for in living next to Baltic, Denny way, I-5, the floor above any bar ever, etc.
Did you miss the part where the Baltic room upgraded their sound system?
“The pot is calling the kettle black Maus.”
God, you’re as terrible with appeals to hypocrisy as you are to the most basic of analogies. I’m sorry that you got such a low score on the SATs.
“it is in fact a new problem. Joe didn’t start complaining until the Baltic Room installed a more powerful sound system.”
Well, of course he has a right to complain if it’s been increasing in sound levels, but the point is that it *has* always been a thumping club.
i have really bad insomnia. i sleep with earplugs and a thick eye mask. it’s not uncommon for me to get 4-5 hours of sleep a night regularly. i am such a light sleeper that a person quietly walking by my bedroom can sometimes be enough to wake me up. my hearing’s been tested and it’s well above average. i can hear people having conversations about me from across the room when they think i’m too far away. it likely accounts for part of my sleeping troubles.
i respect your right to not like loud dance music. i know what it’s like to lay awake staring at the ceiling wishing i could sleep. however, i don’t respect your method of handling the problem – to stereotype a bunch of people you haven’t met and to use police as a means of dealing with the issue rather than talking to the people involved. stereotyping everyone who goes to the baltic room is beyond lame. strange as it may seem, there are a bunch of people out there who genuinely enjoy something that you don’t like. not because they’re on drugs or because they can’t hear, but because they have different tastes than you do. i love dance music. over the years i’ve been a music writer, music event thrower, dj, dabbled in making music, run music websites, etc. i wear earplugs at loud events, both music and non-music.
you say that it’s sad that a generation is being brought up to enjoy music and dancing late at night. i think it’s sad that any generation would feel like the way to resolve a non-violent problem is to call the cops rather than talking to people. the people who throw music events aren’t drug-addled bogeymen who are laughing maniacally at your suffering. there is no money in throwing dance music events (and probably most other genres of music either). they’re often maxing out their credit cards and paying out of pocket. they aren’t trying to hurt anyone. they aren’t the faceless enemy… they have names, email addresses, phone numbers, all of which you could likely access quite easily with a quick google. many different people throw shows on different days at the baltic room, so talking to the club itself isn’t necessarily talking to your intended audience.
i’m not saying that everyone who throws music events is an open-minded person with a good heart. some are, some aren’t. but assuming they all don’t care and the best solution is to go behind their back and call the cops repeatedly is passive-aggressive at best. regardless of whether you’re “right” or “wrong”, you’re outnumbered in this situation. i don’t think that assuming people you don’t know are jerks and behaving accordingly is going to help accomplish the end goal of being able to sleep.
it’s not uncommon for kids who throw house parties to pay for neighbors to stay in nice hotel rooms.
some people who like loud music also like being part of a larger community. it’s entirely possible they’d want to do something to help you if they viewed you as another neighbor who lives down the street rather than that guy who’s trying to destroy the thing in life that they care most about.
also, i’ll happily say anything i write online to anyone’s face. saying you would kick someone’s ass for having a different opinion isn’t the most encouraging conversation-starter though. :P
I live closer to the Baltic Room than “Joe” does. I’ve never once even thought of complaining because I’ve never heard an absurd amount of noise coming from there in the past 3 years. Joe is a wuss.
Garbage trucks, glass recycling trucks, busses, SUVS, motorcycles, dogs, drunken conversations, Lady Gaga songs played from multiple bar/restaurants, Madonna songs from Panache, random bands marching in the streets, drummers, anarchists protesters, police sirens, ambulances, screeching brakes, mating cats, bands playing at Cal Anderson and Volunteer Parks, shouting, yelling, screaming….. welcome to city life… open your mind and plug your fucking ears. Good night.
Kim wrote, “i don’t respect your method of handling the problem – to stereotype a bunch of people you haven’t met and to use police as a means of dealing with the issue rather than talking to the people involved.”
But a couple days earlier, Joe wrote, “First complaints were all direct: Two in-person visits to tell them the thumping was rattling my windows two blocks away (the on-site manager’s response at that time was that they were exempt from noise restrictions …). Following those complaints, there were a number of e-mails, also involving someone in the Mayor’s nightlife office. Only after weeks of no resolution did I (as is specifically prescribed by the noise ordinance) begin calling police.”
Kim, consider how long it takes for the following conversation to happen: “9-1-1. What’s your emergency?” “Excessive noise.” “Thank you. Please hold.” At that point, the call can be prioritized just as if it came in on the non-emergency number.
Keep fighting the good fight.
(I have to wonder if the people who think this level of noise is OK have suffered hearing loss from years of subjecting themselves to the dB levels they want the clubs to be able to make, and don’t realize that their own deafness isn’t universal.)
Should we also consider how much experience you have with making these types of calls Phil? My neighbor calls on noise all the time and the police come. It make take them away from more important things…
Click.
Idiot. Good night.
So, Kim, you think that it’s Joe’s responsibility to contact every single promoter of the shows at The Baltic Room? And to talk to him/her about the noise problem? That’s alot to ask.
In my opinion, it is the responsibility of the Baltic Room’s owner, as part of the contract with a promoter, to be sure the noise ordinances are followed.
Hey “Joe”…you’re the one living above or beside a club…in capitol hill!
Shut the fuck up and move.
A different take on the joe saga – http://www.seattlerex.com/sleepless-in-seattle/
It is my understanding that Joe lives something like TWO BLOCKS away from this club. There is every reason for him to speak out on this issue, in spite of your wish to silence him.
Yes, this argument is a perfect example. Should Joe just put in some ear plugs? No! The rest of the neighborhood should get quieter. Everyone else is responsible for his silence, not him.
And yeah, I don’t want to live on top of the noise, but near it, how does this make me a hypocrite? I would never live in a mixed use building, simple as that. I don’t understand why this is so hard for people when there are so many options to be NEAR but not IN the noise and bustle of our neighborhood.
… Joe you just sound like a freak now. Quit demanding your neighbors to call and clog the 911 lines just to sooth this obsession. How about this: if people living on Capitol Hill need to make a noise complaint, they will. Maybe it’s only you who has the problem?
Kimberley wrote, “i don’t respect your method of handling the problem – to stereotype a bunch of people you haven’t met and to use police as a means of dealing with the issue rather than talking to the people involved.”
But a couple days earlier, Joe wrote, “First complaints were all direct…”
Sorry… by people involved, I meant the people who are organizing the event. Yes, most events use the club’s sound system, but the people organizing the event are typically the ones who would be telling performers to turn the sound down if they started jacking the mixer up. Venue owners often aren’t even physically present.
@calhoun: No, I’m not saying “Talk to every person who has ever thrown a show at the Baltic Room!”… but most of the events are recurring weekly events, so it’s the same few promoters week after week. Also, their information is readily available online to send a generic cut & paste email… that’s less effort than walking ;)
I don’t consider it useful to view the world in terms of “Should it be my responsibility to ” vs. “What can I do on my own to make a positive change in my world (and potentially other people’s)?” Few problems are solely any one person’s responsibility… and, setting aside whether Joe is or isn’t justified in his stance… apart from my ethical feelings about direct communication and the use of 911, I also feel that bureaucracy just isn’t typically a more efficient method to reach a resolution.
“Thumping bass is analogous to second-hand smoke. Just look at the research. It is an insidious form of pollution having ill health effects of which most are largely ignorant. “
There is no research that indicates that bass being audible causes cancer or shortens lifespan. There is research that indicates that musical training improves cognitive function and memory among the elderly though.
Do you have any clue what you’re writing about, still?? As has been remarked many many times, Joe lives *two blocks* away from the Baltic Room. And Joe is not complaining about every sound in the neighborhood, just about unnecessary excessive noise. Frankly, your bizarre Ayn-Rand-with-dementia remarks are in flat contradiction to any notion of civil society. For instance, in Corey v. Brown, Supreme Court Justice Brennan writes: “The State’s interest in protecting the well-being, tranquility, and privacy of the home is certainly of the highest order in a free and civilized society.”
Oh, and one last thing. Earplugs are often uncomfortable and can pose various health risks to your ears, in addition to being largely ineffective in reducing the annoyance from the sort of noise that Joe is complaining about.
Carey v. Brown, excuse me.